| Comments: | I've read the information that you present and it seems to be informal in many ways. I feel that you as an individual are knowledgeable in this market and in the traditional ways. Please understand, I've asked these questions in the past to my upline and received the facts (tax papers). They do make the income that is predicted and I'm "duplicating" their process as we speak. Yes, I am getting paid very well. But, there is another tangent that has not been discussed. The business is not all about making money. It's about balance in life. It's about the American dream and the pursuit of happiness. Sir, your focus in life is different than other people. I know you do mean well but I've not read anything positive in this article. Any corporation anywhere is going to have some "dirt on it's face" simply because it's ran by human beings and it's exposed to human beings. No one or nothing is perfect. But, I do know that anyone can do anything they want if they believe it AND work for it. So |
| April 19, 2002 12:17:27 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I take it your probably some kind of engineer or at least someone holding a noble degree of some kind. Talk about information overload. In the grand scheem of things I have come to the conclusion you have an extreem bias towards Amway. Always the same old story with people like you. Nothing but class warfare. Pitting one group of people against another. I bet you are a liberal democrat. End of story. |
| April 19, 2002 02:04:11 (GMT Time)
Scott's note Actually I vote republican. I do have a bias towards the business becuase I feel it is a very inefficient way to distribute goods and terribly unproductive way to make money. The site visitor did not debate any of those issues I raised on my site. |
| Comments: | Dear Friend, Reading this info on Amway has been very interesting. I have been approached to get involved with what seems to be a very similar business Interactive Distribution Services, which I am told is big in Australia and the states. Do you have any information on this organisation and is it similarly shaky? Thank you Steve |
| April 18, 2002 13:52:50 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Notice that the author of this website (and others) does not disclose his professional background or business experience/accomplishments. Nowhere to be found is a photograph or biography. It is easy to critique any organization or belief system on the condition of anonymity: the critic is not required to compare the accomplishments of individuals who succeeded in the business with his own (presumably more modest) accomplishments. My challenge: What has the author accomplished to merit his "expert" status? |
| April 17, 2002 20:43:35 (GMT Time)
Scott's note Typically most IBOs downplay the need for any "educational background". To IBOs, the less formal education you have the better. But, if you need to know I have a BS in Mechanical Engineering and an MBA from Purdue University. As I state in the introduction to my site I encourage people to do their own research. I've never claimed to be an "expert" in the AmQuix business. I just present data and a very simple analysis, for a supposedly very simple business model. The analysis presented of the business model and the need for retail sales are plain common sense. If this site visitor beleives any business can be built without sales and minimizing expenses, then they went to a different business school than I did. It never ceases to amaze me how Quixtar IBOs must rely on experts to give them opinions rather than using the common sense and the brain God gave them to analyze something so simple as the Quixtar busienss for themselves. |
| Comments: | Take the results. Take all the thousands of people who achieve their dreams and goals using this business as a vehicle and take all the people who achieve their dreams and goals by following your alternative (is there an alternative or are you just a spoiler of dreams)and see which way yeilds the most RESULTS! It is a shame to think of all the people's goals and dreams that will never be realized because they chose to listen to your corrupt spin doctrine on a clearly intelligent profitable business. |
| April 15, 2002 23:45:40 (GMT Time)
Scott's note According to the latest Quixtar SA-4400, the Average active Quixtar IBO surveyed, of which over 60% were considered active, earned a gross income, before expensese, of $115/month. This real success....if you live in a third world country |
| Comments: | I read your site thoroughly and your spin is very deceptive and inacurate. You cannot judge the entire business opportunity on what a group of ibo's do. You cannot throw the baby out with the bath water. Also, regarding attrition, there is tremendous attrition in everything in life-business, marriage, etc. Most businesses in America fail. Everyone who decides to be successful in this business though and follows the system is successful...it is just that simple. This is the best business opportunity in existance bar none. |
| April 15, 2002 23:34:37 (GMT Time)
Scott's noteIf it is the best business opportunity, how come it can't manage to keep 1/2 of its participants from year to year? If it were so great how come so many people leave it each year? Maybe the "market" is just stupid? |
| Comments: | Thank you for an excellent site! I am not an IBO; I recently attended a Quixtar meeting with a friend who is completely brainwashed. (she said I'd be free at 23, I went along to be polite.) She firmly believes that leaders speak at conventions "out of the goodness of their hearts" and "why would they need to be paid for speaking when they're so rich already?" This is just the beginning of what she believes, she has an almost religious obsession. I've told her if she wants to be a part of this, she should know the facts, (and this website is the best dose of reality around!) Now if I can only get her to read it and believe it! She says that "she's been warned about harmful websites, and not to believe their negative lies." Help! My aunt died with $10,000 of Amway junk in her garage, I don't want my friend to do "the business" without knowing the facts! Any advice for me in helping her see through "the Quixtar family"? |
| April 15, 2002 17:19:45 (GMT Time)
Scott's note There is not much you can do to convince her otherwise. People will believe what they want to believe. Experience is the best teacher. Let her do her thing and be there in case she needs a friend when it is all over. |
| Comments: | "Bob Allen declared bankruptcy in 1996." Well, he's certainly in good company: (1) Charles Goodyear, the founder of Goodyear Tires was a bankrupt;(2) Donald Trump, although not bankrupt, was insolvent in the early 1990s; (3)Walt Disney was a bankrupt. What you don't seem to understand Scott, is that these entrepreneurs took risks which didn't always work out, but they bounced back. They had heart. You are purely an academic: successful entrepreneurs also have heart, not just knowledge. |
| April 14, 2002 17:51:27 (GMT Time)
Scott's note Sure he has heart, but I still question if he is successful at anything besides selling books. |
| Comments: | For those of you who want to read what a SUCCESSFUL entrepreneur and millionaire has to say about MLM, go to Bob Allen's website. Allen is the author of New York Times Bestsellers "Nothing Down", "Creating Wealth", and "Multiple Streams of Income". Website is multiplestreamsofincome.com. Use the keywords: Still Skeptical. This former skeptic endorses MLM. Remember:"Listen to people who have what you want. If they don't have what you want, don't listen to them". Who would you rather listen to? |
| April 13, 2002 17:04:54 (GMT Time)
Scott's note I went to the website and found the "still skeptical" section was empty. Bob Allen declared bankruptcy in May of 1996 I'm "still skeptical" about Mr. Allen's success outside of his book writing. |
| Comments: | Periodical business literature such as "Forbes" or "Fortune" magazine are written by salaried writing staff: how would they know anything about building a business? If they were entrepreneurs, they wouldn't be writng for a magazine. The Millionaire Next Door is written about "millionaires" (i.e., net worth $1M or more). Expecting many people to be millionaires from MLM is indeed unrealistic. However, people can make $60,000 plus/yr in MLM, which is more than enough to retire. You're grasping at straws! |
| April 13, 2002 16:28:22 (GMT Time)
Scott's note The last Forbes piece was written by an "independent business owner" otherwise known as a freelance writer. Anyone looking at the people in Quixtar will find that those few "netting" $60,000/year have not "retired". They just traded their day job for a night and weekend job showing the plan. If one were to "retire" and not do anything, their businesses would quickly fall apart due to the high turnover. I wonder why Quixtar diamond Al LeBlanc sold his diamondship instead of just living of the "residuals" and be retired? He knows if he didn't continue to work the business it would fall apart. |
| Comments: | The previous post raises a significant issue which isn't addressed anywhere in this website: if MLM is indeed unethical and unrewarding as a business opportunity, then why do so many respected authors/business people endorse it? Examples are Zig Ziglar, Richard Poe (former "Success" editor), Eric Tyson (who endorses "quality MLMs" such as Mary Kay and Amway in "Investing for Dummies"), Robert G. Allen (author of Multiple Streams of Internet Income), and Robert Kiyosaki? Anyone care to answer? |
| April 12, 2002 23:58:52 (GMT
Time)
Scott's note Why do these people endorse the MLM business? It is Quite simple. Books speaking positively about the MLM business can expect to be sold in tens or hundreds of thousands of copies to just a single MLM organization in their "book of the month" programs. The popular author can be paid thousands of dollars to speak. The incentive to pander to these groups is very high. In the popular book "The millionaire next door", which studied the characteristic occupations of millionaires, it was not once mentioned that MLM was as a source of millionaires. Periodical business literature such as Forbes and Fortune magazine, with little business to lose from the MLM particpants, write negatively about the business. MLM is a target market for "Success" magazine, so it writes positively about MLM. |
| Comments: | Do your due diligence from this website, AND by reading these books: -"Network Marketing for Dummies" by Zig Ziglar (Ziglar is a marketing and sales legend in the "legitimate" corporate world); -"The Business School for People Who Like Helping Other People" by Robert Kiyosaki (Kiyosaki is a self-made millionaire with an international following); and -"Multiple Streams of Income" by Robert G. Allen (same as Kiyosaki) |
| April 12, 2002 04:44:59 (GMT
Time) Research about Mr. Allen Research about Mr. Kiyosaki |
| Comments: | I have been an IBO for 3 yrs, i have been at 18% level for 14 months. calculating all my pay checks received, i have averaged $2,135.58 per month. Two months ago, i contracted a decease which put me into hospital for 3 months and out of work for 6 months. Fortunately we build our business and continue to receive bonuses while i was sick. Since you are encouraging people leave Amway, i am sure you would be happy to replace my bonus income that i will lose every month with your own money. (Thought not) |
| April 12, 2002 02:45:57 (GMT
Time) Scott's note $2,125.58 per month in bonuses at the 18% level calculates to a PV, without retail selling, of 5,900 PV, and no payments to his downline. According to the Quixtar bonus schedule, the 18% bonus level is between 2,500 and 3,999 PV. It would seem the site visitor had either a unusally high percentage of sales at retail prices as well as having no downline payments, or a bonus level much higher than the 18% claimed. This site visitor is encouraged to send me an e-mail about the conflicting numbers. How can a person who contracted a disease just two months ago have already been in the hospital for three months and already out of work for six months? |
| Comments: | I am an IBO, Its interesting how when i am showing a plan to some one who has and will never acheive anything in their life, they crap on about how stupid and illegal business the is. I was about to quit but recently i got the courage up to show five friends who were already millionaires in different businesses, only one join the business. But they all encouraged me and said how great the company is. |
| April 12, 2002 01:29:43 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Great Scott, i can see you have a great understanding in business cycles and that when a business levels off it means its dead. this must mean that Microsoft & general Motors must be going to die soon since thier sales haven't have the same sale growth like the last ten years. Guess what, s, thousand of jobs go. |
| April 12, 2002 01:08:43 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | A previous post mentioned a legal case in which Proctor & Gamble paid some college students to post malicious information about Amway. The case is cited as "Amway Corporation vs. Proctor & Gamble, U.S. District Court, Western District of Michigan, 10/13/98". You can obtain a copy of it by doing a search with Google using the key words "proctor and gamble amway college students". It will be your first hit and the link is www.amquix.info/aus/amvsp&g.htm Is this site Scott's "real job"? |
| April 11, 2002 13:51:02 (GMT
Time) Scott's note College students were never paid by P&G for such sites nor was P&G ever accused of such by Amway. The case cited by the poster was thrown out of court for lack of merit. See: Amway P&G suit over Judges ruling |
| Comments: | Scott's note Question posts like these will be
deleted Scott, you didn't answer my question: is Robert G. Allen a stooge as well? Dr. Charles King teaches an MLM course at the University of Illinois at Chicago. He has a doctorate in business administration from Harvard University and is a professor of Marketing at the University. Interested parties can read an interview with him at www.brilliantcompensation.org. So Scott, is Dr. King a "stooge" as well? Is everyone who disagrees with you labelled a stooge, or have you ever considered that they may be right? April 11, 2002 13:31:13 (GMT Time) Scott's note This question to Dr. King was taken from "www.brilliantcompensation.org" In sizing up a MLM opportunity, what do we need to know about the company itself? "Look at the sales history: Is the company in rapid growth, or has it reached a plateau?" Charles W. King, Professor of Marketing at the University of Illinois at Chicago, Doctorate business-..... combined Sales of the North American Amway and Quixtar businesses have dropped 38% between 1999 and 2001. Mr. King might say the business has already peaked. |
| Comments: | I remember when Mcdonalds cost $15,000 to buy a franchise and the US congress tried to ban it saying it was illegal. Now, my uncle just bought a franchise in brisbane, Australia for $1.25 million. May be one day people will see how great the Amway business is and it will cost $1 mill to join. |
| April 11, 2002 05:11:18 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I was recently at a Financial planning seminar, the speaker was ask about Amway & MLM by one of the listeners. He said "look at it this way, Amway is like an excercise bike, if two people buys a bike, and only one lose weight. Is it the fault of the bike or the lazy butt who didn't work it." It seems to me Scott that your making excuses for the lazy people out there. |
| April 11, 2002 05:07:44 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | i have notice that you did not mention a court case where an executive of Proctor & Gamble (since been dismissed), paid college students to write websites fabricating lies about Amway and alticor. I wonder if scott is one of them. |
| April 11, 2002 04:58:41 (GMT Time)
Scott's note There has never been a court case against P&G for paying college students to write websites against Amway |
| Comments: | I am a CPA tax accountant, my clients have ask me to
evaluate whether the amway business is a good business to try. Looking
through your site, i am disappointed that it is on one view point, to dump
on amway in a stealth way. i wonder if you have any experience in business
at all. One of my clients has a retail business selling similar product
range. They have to sell $55,235 per month to make a net profit of $1,000
(after paying stock, staff, insurance, rates, rent, water, bank interest,
heating etc). April 11, 2002 04:47:04 (GMT Time) Scott's note "During the two-year period of 1979-1980, approximately 139 Direct Distributorships, or less than 1% of all Wisconsin Distributorships, had an average annual adjusted gross income in excess of $12,000. The average annual net income (after the deduction of business expenses) for all Wisconsin Direct Distributorships was, in fact, a net loss of $918." --State of Wisconsin v. Amway Corporation et al, 7/82, in which Amway and a number of Amway distributors were fined for illegal misrepresentation of income. |
| Comments: | Ladies and Gentlemen, Some common sense advice: Robert Kiyosaki recommends network marketing in "Cash Flow Quadrant", yet he has never had his own network marketing business. Mr. Kiyosaki of course will continue to recommenced MLM as long as he is paid thousands of dollars to speak for Quixtar groups, and his books are on their recommended book lists. Understand his motives for recommending network marketing.... Robert Kiyosaki is a paid stooge. Who do you want to listen to? |
| April 10, 2002 21:01:30 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Ladies and Gentlemen, Some common sense advice: "Listen to people who have what you want". Robert Kiyosaki recommends network marketing in "Cash Flow Quadrant" Robert Allen devotes an entire chapter to MLM benefits in "Multiple Streams of Income". They are both millionaires. Scott Larsen is an obsessive vindictive failure. Who do you want to listen to? |
| April 10, 2002 16:22:32 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | To the people who state to go see the ibofacts page you are so wrong. The page does state that ibos can make a profit off the tapes and functions but most line of sponserships state they do not make any profit from the tapes and functions. Like WWDB! |
| April 9, 2002 10:14:30 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | To the people who state to go see the ibofacts page you are so wrong. The page does state that ibos can make a profit off the tapes and functions but most line of sponserships state they do not make ant profit from the tapes and functions. Like WWDB! |
| April 9, 2002 10:13:28 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I have been in WWDB for some time now and just today filled out my inactivity letter so I can get of WWDB line of sponsership. My upline told me I was negative when I stated to him that WWDB lies were just to much to perpepuate to any other people. I went and crunched the numbers just like you have done many of times and there real profits come from the systems. I heard Greg Duncan made $10 million dollars last year. So if that is true quixtar profits then WWDB would have made most of the bonuses paid out by quixtar. Which we know is not true. Is there any lines of sponsership out there with no rip-off systems. Thanks. |
| April 9, 2002 10:01:28 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Basically they make money off the tapes and other "motivational products." Their business plan is full of holes and is the rich feeding off the hopes and wishes of the poorer masses. Go to a meeting, get involved, and see how sad it is for yourself. Forget all the emotional appeals, see if the math and logic makes sense (which it wont) and judge for yourself.... |
| April 9, 2002 06:23:31 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Got invited to a meeting tonight...none of it made any good business sense, also I was even more disgusted to see that this is really Amway. How do you justify drawing pyramids in a meeting then call it a good opportunity. If they are so good, why must they recruit us? Why do they have to charge money to members to go to the meetings? USE COMMON SENSE! |
| April 9, 2002 06:18:09 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Scott, congratulations on this most informative, knowledgeable website based on actual and derived facts/figures. I joined as an IBO in Australia and if it wasn't for my upline Diamond incriminating himself by mentioning that there is lots of negative material on the Internet I would still be in the business today. I got out after 2 weeks. |
| April 9, 2002 03:37:03 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | All I know is that if i have to annoy my friends the way one of my friends has begun annoying me with his sales pitch, I want nothing to do with the company. I am happy for those of you who supposedly love this type of work, but it isn' for me... |
| April 5, 2002 23:23:11 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I want to thank you for your website..... I knew something was too good to be true. I sent it to a friend of mine, that was really getting wrapped up in this and now he is out! Thank you Thank you Thank you! |
| April 5, 2002 14:25:42 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Scott Great site. My wife & I are IBOs in Canberra, Australia as part of IDA (Gulick, Meadows, Yager as fostered)with the Chathams (Upline US Diamonds Jim & Kathy Paullin). We are not actively building as we have better things to do with our time & money even if we did buy our way to 1000pv (actively encouraged). We joined in 1992 and have seen the numbers at all functions fall year by year. AS we have not been to a function for a couple of years I can't verify what is the state now but |
| April 4, 2002 06:44:24 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | |
| April 2, 2002 21:23:10 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Well, Quixtar sure beats the endless job of never being a leader. You know all you say is negative and you show no positive and there is positive. If you spend as much time trying to build your own business as you have on this website, you might be a millionaire by now. I'll tell you that if being in a group that supports each other and provides the best products available (and they beat the pants off most of the store brands)makes me ignorant in your view, then label me. I've seen the check |
| April 1, 2002 04:22:32 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I found your site very funny. Based on the information you have provided people I would guess you must be in my sons 3rd grade class. As a Civil Engineer I have research the Quixtar Business model and found it to be very sound. |
| March 29, 2002 18:02:55 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | went to a meeting recently - thanks for a great resource |
| March 29, 2002 10:04:56 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | My wife and I were 2600 pins in the WWDB group under our diamonds the Shores. I have mixed feelings about the business and the support system. While I could go on for hours typing our experience, I will just say here that I was never pressured into buying things we didn't need, however, items were suggested. We never felt that we were judged and that we were alwalys supported in both our decisions in the business and our personal lives--maybe we are exceptions from what I seen on this site. I be |
| March 29, 2002 08:05:46 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | refute this site, please do so with facts and figures, not dreams and name calling. Please refrain from quoting Dexter, Bill and the rest of the very few millionaires in thae scheme. It just emphasizes your lack of business acumen and common sense. True entrepreneurs worry about the little things, these things don't take care of themselves. Sorry kids but the Amway Fairy and Quixtar Claus don't exist. Play the lottery, your odds are better! |
| March 27, 2002 17:19:10 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I love how the Ambots response to the author of this site is to call him an idiot. He says he has held back in recruiting people for this wonderful opportunity. Yeah right. These fools will recruit anyone. People with actual great opportunities don't offer them to ever loser sitting at a diner counter or reading a book at B&N. The person who built this site did so with actual FACTS and QUOTES. www.ibofacts.com is more of the fluff crap in the "training" tapes. If you Quixtar IBOs want to |
| March 27, 2002 17:18:32 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I feel as though my husband has been taken over by aliens. We are so much in debt, using money of close relatives to help our large family survive. I shed copious tears every day that he is turning his back on basic Biblical principles--there is NO way that Our Lord and Saviour, in His holy poverty would include this monstrous manipulative cult of greed and materialism in His repertoire...these people are in danger of losing their very souls. I am a conservative republican but then so would h |
| March 27, 2002 08:43:22 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | Unfortunitely my opinion was more than 600 characters so it had to be split. There is no other way to respond to a pathetic loser in less words. |
| March 27, 2002 07:17:43 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | have,because I knew that they would fail in this buisness(like you obviously did) so I did not want to waste my time on them. I'm sure that you are not supprised by this cause this happens all the time to me (running into IDIOTS like youself). So I just look past the IDIOTS like you to get to the LEADERS THAT WON'T FAIL!!! (you know the PEOPLE THAT ARE NOT LIKE YOU,DUMBASS!) Hope you enjoy your life sentence to the time clock! |
| March 27, 2002 07:14:23 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I just wanted to thank you for writing all this garbage for those who are to weak to actually make a huge change in there life. I just wanted to tell you that I refused a few useless people (obviousy like youself) the privilage to be able to have the same great opportunity that I have,because I knew that they would fail in this buisness(like you obviously did) so I did not want to waste my time on them. I'm sure that you are not supprised by this cause this happens all the time to me (running in |
| March 27, 2002 07:11:32 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | You may want to check out www.ibofacts.com. It attempts to answer your site (I assume). I was refered to it by my sponsor and friend after I confronted him about this site. He seems to think its more "credible" than this one...I assume its because it agrees with him. Thanks for the great site and God Bless! |
| March 26, 2002 02:27:43 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I am a current IBO and have found your site very eye opening. From day one I thought there was something, how shall I say...not right with some of the things I have encountered.Fortunately,I haven't been outright decieved by my upline...just mislead. They don't seem to notice how they perpetuate ways of doing things that end up misleading those they sign up or show the plan to. They are very sincere and wonderful people who don't realize that they are being misled as well.You may want to check o |
| March 26, 2002 02:02:51 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | As a current IBO, we buy what we like to use. After being snubbed by our upline at the time of a death in the family, we became "inactive" in the meetings, etc. Watching the corporation from afar without the regular propaganda input over the past few years, it became evident there was decline. The corporation obviously began cutting expenses. We've observed the turnover of products that are hardly on the market long enough to see if anyone likes them. |
| March 19, 2002 01:49:36 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | former Quixtar IBO Every once in awhile I get the feeling that maybe I could still make the business work. I start thinking maybe I didn't show enough plans or grow enough personally or maybe I just didnt' dream big enough. But then I come to www.amquix.info and all is right in my world, again. The tapespeak quickly fades from my once heavily conditioned Quixbot brain and I realize the prices ARE too high, the plan is filled with lies. a |
| March 18, 2002 23:36:54 (GMT Time) |
| Comments: | I am a former IBO of Quixtar. I have spent much wasted time/money on them to get screwed in the end. If I would have known about this web site before I joined I would not have joined them at all. Let me say that this web site is very informative, and professional. I have created my own web site to help educate the masses about the truth behind Amway/Quixtar. To learn more: http://www.learn.to/ecom I am currently tied up in a legal matter with the profiteering gluttons. |
| March 17, 2002 06:07:18 (GMT Time) |