Last update 03/08/2003

Hey AmQuitter below, you have proven one thing for sure. Quitters post negative on the internet. Scott, all of this would be much more realistic if you could find an IBO that just achieved Diamond, or just achieved Q-12 that will tell you how terrible it is in this business. But Scott, you will never find that - will you? Just more AmQuitters posting negative (yes there is money in the system...for everyone -- its not a secret). Scott, help the AmQuitters understand that not everyone is in the same BSM system. There are many who build the business independently, with risk and return. In fact, I've noticed more positive comments lately. How about starting AmQuitters.com - its certainly more truth in advertising! March 11, 2003 04:18:00 (GMT Time)

Editors note: Check out Resigned Diamond Bo Short's Page

I challenge you to post a positive response about Quixtar. I guarentee I'm not the only one in the whole world with a positive response to this incredible business. I'm involved with Quixtar and have been since it's conception. I think it's funny reading your "research". First, have you researched your job as you've researched a Multi-million dollar business? Probably not. Second, would you agree Bass Pro, Disney, Whirlpool, Neiman Marcus and many other companies are reputable? I think so. If they are involved with Quixtar, what do you know that they don't? I also think it's funny how people treat this BUSINESS just like their job and expect the same results. In business you get paid for what you produce so if you don't produce anything......hint...you won't receive anything. Unlike people's job where they just have to show up and get paid for doing as little work as possible. March 11, 2003 19:42:17 (GMT Time)

I applaud you and your website, you seem to have such a grasp for the business and how it works. I actually viewed your site about Six Months ago before I became an IBO. I am so glad I did not listen to you then and I am glad I do not listen to you now!! I think it is sad, that you either turn people away from the business before they even experience it. The biggest part, are the people building Quixtar that are not man enough to get the job done and you give them a good reason to QUIT. I wish you would put up another website about how you are doing in your job, and your age to know how much longer you will be someone elses slave. March 10, 2003 20:01:02 (GMT Time)

All negative comments come from those who quit. All positive comments come from those who make it. Obviously alot of people make it, just look at the FACTS! You got to love those "percentage" people. What's the percentage of employees that get to be CEO? My former employer has been around 83 years, 3 CEO's all with the same last name. What's the percentage of people that enrolled in college that graduated? What's the percentage of first marriages that worked out? I guess all of those things are bad too. AGAIN, those on the Q-12 list made it work - for them. Anyone CAN make this work; those that don't get to post negative on the internet. March 9, 2003 18:02:15 (GMT Time)

To the comment listed 3 below: The main reason you don't see pro-Quixtar facts is that Scott, sitting in Germany, edits or deletes them for his benefit. Here are some facts, look quick, they won't be around long. 2002 saw 1464 IBO's (single or couples) qualify for a Cash Award of $10,000 and a trip valued at approx $3000. That's on top of monthly income. 443 qualified as 'first time' Platinums. Hundreds of others got over 7500PV for the first time last year. And you can bet none post negative on the web. One FACT remains true, those that produce are rewarded, those that quit get to complain and blame others. March 7, 2003 22:48:42 (GMT Time)

I was wondering if any pro-Quixtar person has ever taken the time to refute the "facts" listed on this site. I've often seen many people argue that Scott has gotten his stuff wrong here, but ZERO PROOF, just allegations. Be nice to see someone actually show where Scott is wrong. I know I can't, but then again, I figured out the scam on my own pretty quickly. Maybe I'm missing something? PROVE Scott and me wrong. I've never met Scott, but I think if someone took the time and gave some concrete evidence, he'd share that with the world. March 6, 2003 21:45:44 (GMT Time)

Hey, On your page of groups you missed Micheal Diamonds International. They are located at www.mdi2k.com Access #7837X, no other info required. They follow the yager system but have some changes such as the eagle program. Posted inside and different from the others. They are based in Ohio, and Canada, and California, Vancouver, Florida mainly. Diamonds inside are Scott & Mj Micheal - Double - Leader Dr. George and Marian Bryniawsky - Diamond under scott Casey & Cathy Combden - Broke away to start interbiz. under dr george Bill & Janice Kerr - Diamond under dr george Jeff & Alyssia Hummel - Diamond under bill Mike & Mary DiStallio - Dimaond under craig bishop Brock & Dale Rutledge - Diamond under dr george Craig & Karen Loupelle - Diamond - remember them :)LOL what a story under jeff hummell Criag & Denise Bishop - Diamond under scott Brad & Kim Dehaven - Diamond under scott March 5, 2003 16:15:59 (GMT Time)

My experience has been very positive. Your "facts" are not correct, do more research. The IBO's who haven't made any money are the ones who choose to fill their time with garbage like this on the internet. This site is like the bathroom walls of our society. I will waste my time no more with this uneducated opinion. March 5, 2003 04:43:49 (GMT Time)

You seem to be very bored and bitter and you should find more productive use of your spare time. your facts are partial the BBB says nothing against Alticore or Quixtar and when you talk of tools funding lifestyles you neglect to calculate the overhead cost of those items and yes there are individuals who can be shady but the system works your chart even shows an upswing mostly becaus the economy is fluctuating and more people are ready to start thier own buisness again. March 3, 2003 08:03:14 (GMT Time)

Scott,

Since I heard this plenty during my years with Amway/Quixtar, I thought your website might somehow benefit from this short e-mail.

Have a good day.

Sincerely,

Paul

Lie #6:

I can directly attribute this lie to five solid years of misery and failure in my own life. In my early 20's, I was a network marketing junkie, and I was hearing this one every day. And I believed it passionately. But eventually, slowly, I began to realize that this statement was nothing more than a way of manipulating me (via guilt) into sticking around for yet-another-month of doing something that absolutely was not working at all.

Let's get something straight: Some businesses don't work. Some enterprises aren't worth doing. Some products are so weak that nothing can save them. Some ventures are doomed from the start, and even if they *appear* to be worthwhile.

Even if some people are capable of making them *look* successful, you must submit them to rigorous testing (as I discussed yesterday) and find out if they're fundamentally profitable or not.

When you figure out that it ain't going to work, DITCH IT and move on! That's quitting out of STRENGTH.

Here's the REAL issue: Are you quitting out of STRENGTH, or are you quitting out of WEAKNESS?

If you quit because you're just lazy or not willing to learn, then you're quitting out of weakness. Too bad for you.

If you quit because you've determined that you're headed in the wrong direction, then you're quitting out of strength. And you should quit as fast as you possibly can, so that you can WIN at something else.

So here's the REAL truth: Winners never quit out of weakness, and quitters even never get far enough to quit out of strength.

Just like everything else I've been talking about this week, shrewd marketing uses real numbers and results to judge winning and losing propositions and get down to the real truth.

Back to my life in MLM: I bought a book called 'Prospecting Sucks' by Dan Kennedy (http://www.tannah.net/prospecting.html) and thankfully started using direct marketing to build that business. Actually, that approach DID work. BUT - I also discovered that the cost of acquiring a customer was way too high and the return took so long. Simply put, there were many other businesses where the numbers were vastly superior, and required far less 'manual labor.'

When I was building that business via shoe leather, the true cost was hidden from me, and I thought it would be worthwhile in the end. But - when I reduced the acquisition of a new customer to a *dollar figure*, though, it became obvious that I was making a mistake. I quit. Out of strength.

After that, my next adventure was actually in a traditional corporate job in a small company. It was a lot of fun, and eventually, very profitable.

Hi Scott.

With all these Quixtar (and old Amway) IBOs consuming tons of Nutrilite

like candy, three or four times a day, wouldn't you think that the corporaton would publish

data on the well being of their distributors? such as:

1. Do they visit their doctors fewer times than before?

2. Are they less susceptible to colds and flu?

3. Do they feel energetic? The diamonds may stay up till 3 am doing a meeting but they sleep all day the next day.

Well, I'm just sorry you feel that way. It's too bad when people get lied to and cheated, which you obviously have. I just figure that when someone screws someone else, it will eventually come back to haunt them. When I worked for Amoco Oil Company, I got royally screwed, and when I left the company, I got blacklisted. It was hard for me to find a job for three years, but I don't sit around bashing them. I just don't buy their products. But, do whatever you like. It's your life. Have a good day.

Hi Scott,

I love your site. I was in Amway with my husband in 1990. After five months we happily quit. I'll post my experience one of these days on your site.

Anyway, we were in the Network 21 stuff. Whatever happened to Network 21, which was supposed to be the greatest? Just wondering.

Lynda

I don't think like you about the AMWAY BUSINESS...

sorry....

I found your site and am wondering if you in fact have been to any of the meetings and are you an ibo. Why are you attempting to attack some thing with out the full facts. just because some body sent you a cd because they in fact thought you were someone who could benefit from some thing like this and for you to go on self rightness quest to belittle some for bettering them self and trying to help others do the same.It's my belief that someone should check the man in the mirror or is it the boy in the mirror. who is following in your foot steps and who are you helping to succeed. and i will close with some things are hard to put a price on, helping family-members, marriages, raising kids with values, and the list goes on what is a life worth to you.

Ernest Sacco

....still waiting for Ron to reply....

Hi Scott,

Good talking to you. Thanks for getting back to me.

Dear Mr. Larsen

I don´t now where you come from (country) I´m danish. Just yesterday I went to a meeting here in Denmark, it was a coworker who invited me and my husband.

For about 2 hours we were told about at great chance to get a lot of money I gess it would be about 200.000 us dollar we will be earning the first year..

I must admit my sense of math is better than the persons from amway, because not many people use that much in their house-hold, and there is a limit of people on the earth.

I´m glad to se that someone (you) had made a deasent page about the way amway works.

I hope you can understand my very poor english, byt my german is worse.

Best regards Jeannette

Scott- I read the discussion last night. It was excellent. I really believe he is telling the truth this time. I have several of his BDS tapes. He was/is an awesome speaker. His discussion puts to ease many of my concerns about why he was involved with Quixtar.

He was like a lot of us that were "in". We just didn't get it until the light finally goes off. I read an email about a guy who apparently was in the INA group.

My interest really peaked because I was in INA for several years. His story hit me especially hard. The years of effort and no results. The anguish and guilt you feel. The constant guilt and bad feelings. Asking yourself over and over "what is wrong with me". My heart really went out to this guy. I'm glad he wrote in and finally saw the "light." From the way his letter ended, it sounds like he is still in the grieving process. I hope he can move on with his life.

c ya Christine

My name is Kraig and I live in Texas. I originally joined amway in 1991. I was under Diamonds Mark and Sandy Day. Initially, my wife and I enjoyed the motivating retoric that the rally's and meetings held. We reached the 1500PV level in less than a month and had recruited in excess of 20 people. The problem was that my upline, undereducated and had no people skills, were causing my downline to leave the business as fast as I could get them in. Additionally, they were not paying me my "supposed" check each month. One excuse after another. Long story short we stopped going to meetings and let our membership run out. Second part of the story. I joined the Marine Corps and moved to NC. I was approached by a second individual and we ended up joining again, still under the Yager system. Again enjoying the amount of "people skills" training that I was getting. No follow through on promises made of income, acting in an uneducated fashion and just plain lying about Amway forc Febuary 27, 2003 16:13:12 (GMT Time)

You crack me up. If you spent as much time actually doing something productive rather than "voicing you opinion" you might actually accomplish something in your life. You act as though you've discovered some deep dark secret and you're doing everyone a favor. Yes, WWDB is a for profit organization. Yes, they do make money on the tapes. In fact, they make money with just about every activity they participate in. Help me out here. What's the problem? Do you make money in your profession? Is there a problem with making profit from a person's business activity? Have you ever seen anything from an owner of World Wide that says they are a not-for-profit organization? Your entire page is based on rumour. I really don't get you. What's with all the hatred? It's all heresay. underthepeak@wwdb.org Febuary 27, 2003 04:06:49 (GMT Time)

I was with WWDB and found them to be very dishonest in their activities. I asked about the tool sales and was told that there was no pass down of profit. If so, does anyone know where the money goes? There must be millions each year. Febuary 26, 2003 03:55:49 (GMT Time)

Don't you think that there is some value in this system. A person will only get as much as they put in!!! There probably are some people out there that where misled because some new IBO was trying to make it work for themselves and they didn't know enough about the company or they were flat out weird. But that doesn't prove the SYSTEM doesn't work. My bottom line is no one is holding a gun to anyone's head telling them to join. There are sites like this on the web, that give people that skinny on the facts of the business. I am only a twenty-year-old girl, and I know I am the only one responsible for my actions and my achievements. Life is just about moments and experiences and if you don't walk out of every incident (negative or positive) asking the right questions you will be miserable because of yourself not any company or other individual. Febuary 21, 2003 23:07:29 (GMT Time)

Scott,

Great site! Once I started writing/typing about my experience I knew I would blow by 500 words.

I was in "the business" (notice they DON"T say "in Quixtar/Amway") for 4 years. I always wanted to believe the next plan would turn the corner for me, I was just a decision away. After 100,000 plus miles on the cars, 3-5 nights/week for 3 and a 1/2 years straight - I was frustrated at only getting to only 2300pv. My upline told me "direct is just around the corner" every week during that time. Listen to another tape, read more positive books, show more plans, contact more, just gotta weed through the losers. Then two incidents happened to make me wake up about the biz -

First - The late Dave Thomas of Wendy's fame was a featured speaker at a function (big mistake by Freddy Harteis). Dave spoke of his experiences with foster homes, working in restaurants, and up to founding Wendy's. Dave's a laid back kind of guy, not a rah-rah speaker, so his talk didn't go over well since he wasn't stroking distributors' egos and insecurities. Amway people are VERY insecure. Read some feedback from IBO's on this site and then ask if you would want to work with these "winners". Since the response to Dave was rather tepid, Freddy H decides to try to liven things up. He asks Dave, and I quote, Fred H: "wouldn't you say that people that quit or just don't build this business are just a bunch of whiners and LOSERS?"

Dave: (softly) "No."

To use a cliché, the silence was deafening! Freddy's jaw literally hits the floor. After about 10 very awkward seconds, Fred starts to stammer trying to find a way to goad Dave into calling non-distributors losers. Dave has no part of it and states, "maybe it's just not for them, Fred. I wouldn't call anyone who didn't want to own a Wendy's a loser." Quick thanks-for-coming-Dave and Dave is whisked off the stage. Music blares, out comes Brett Deimler to stroke our egos with the 95% of people wouldn't make the sacrifice to be here routine, but the damage had been done as for the rest of the weekend that was what everyone talked about. At this time, my doubts about the biz were really in force and I noticed how hard my upline and my direct were pumping us with positive "spin" on the function much, much more than usual. I kept in but the spirit wasn't there, leading up to incident number 2.

Free Enterprise weekend in Hershey, PA - with Dexter as the main speaker!!!! Yea!! THE man in Amway. I was "fired up" to hear his words of wisdom on how to build a HUGE business and get back on track to riches (I really was!)

After a big buildup, Dex is introduced near the end of the night and the arena explodes in cheering for almost 5 minutes straight. Then we are then treated to Tonya Harteis' version of the song "Hero" sung lovingly to Dex (hero for what??). If one has been subjected to Ms. Harteis' "singing", you'll know what I mean.

Dex then paces back and forth across stage and speaks about:

1. Education ain't nuthin' - for 10 minutes

2. Gays in the military

3. Fuel useage of his Jetstar

4. Commie Liberals

5. How his son is a "stock genius"

Look at that list. Nothing about goals, STP, contacting, freedom/travel, follow-up, hell, even dreams. Anything about building a big business? Nope. Sorry. (Duh on me, I forgot functions aren't about real info on the biz - just to hype you up for the next function)

I said to my upline "I drove 9 hours for that??" and promptly went to my hotel room. I was rather disappointed to say the least. Dex had been way hyped and I really thought I would get useful info on building a business, not some rambling commentary.

I week later I met my upline and informed him I was leaving the business. Right before our meeting I said to my wife " he'll ask who stole my dream". When i informed my upline that I would be no longer active he says "oh oh, somebody stole your dream". I asked him what my dream was. Silence. After 4 years you'd think he'd know what one of my freaking dreams/desires was. After 4 years of being out of the biz, my life has never been better. If that makes me a LOSER, so much the better! the only debt I now have is my house payment, my savings is at 5 figures approaching 6 figures, i have a wonderful marriage, and God doesn't love any less since I left Scamway.

I feel bad for my former upline, he's been in the biz for 13 years, is a real student of the biz, but still hasn't gone past the 4000 level and has never had a NET profit. My "retired" direct and ruby both have had to go back to J-J-J-J-J-J-Jobs 3 years ago due to their shrinking incomes. For all you IBO gonna-be-millionaires, if you think this is the ticket, go for it! But I found too many problems, such as:

Worship of $$$$$ and status determined by $$$$$ - I disagree with the concept "I'm rich therefore I'm brilliant/better than you and if you're not rich you're stupid/ a loser. I don't see any Diamonds finding a cure for MS or AIDS, volunteering their time for causes or church (writing a check doesn't count - any selfish loser can do that), serving their country or having their children serve.

Disdain of Education - This is a great one. What would happen if a Diamond heard their Doctor/Lawyer/Accountant, etc. say to them "Education ain't nothin". I think when Dex had his stroke a few years ago, he wanted the most educated Dr. around.

Funny, all the diamonds I have met who have kids have them go to college (sans Dex). Why, since education ain't nothin. Worship through Edification /Counseling- As I said before, there are a lots of huge egos and big insecurity issues, esp. the big pins. insecure people need to have control over others, so we have edification and counseling. Pretty much still High School in the biz. I used to be made fun of by the jocks in school because I wasn't that great in sports, except for Hockey, and they were used to being worshipped. Now that High School is over, the worship is gone and they're bitter and beat up their dog. I see in the responses from IBO's to this site the same want for worship and anyone criticizing the biz is seen as a threat and they lash out due to they are so insecure. If the biz is so great and they are so smart, why the venomous e-mails from IBO's?. Could we be showing the Emperor really has no clothes - or they can't handle the real world outside of Quixtarland.

We used to have a make a big deal and seriously kiss our Direct's ass because they "sacrificed their time to be with us". Bullshit. NOBODY put a gun to their heads and MADE them travel to the meeting. Excuse me, I sacrificed my time to hear the same drivel over and over and get the same stock answers to concerns. When my upline met his wife to be at a function - they counseled and had to get approval from our Diamond to have a relationship (crossline conflict you know). He told me he would have broken it off if it wasn't approved. Wow!! I thought we were INDEPENDENT Business Owners

I also caught the wrath when I didn't go gaga over my Direct's used Cadillac he bought. Then I made the mistake of telling him the only difference between his Sedan DeVille and my Olds 98 Regency (Elite!) was his had a v-8 versus my v-6 and he basically paid 5000 extra to have the brand, well you'd thought I would be excommunicated for being so truthful.

Questions are bad. Such when someone asked if Fred Harteis made money off the function we were at and a diamond SCOLDED us for stage as if we were in first grade and then said Fred was losing money but put it on because he loves us soooooo much. Hey, I worked in convention planning for quite a while so i could easily figure that a LOT of money was being made with 6000+ people @ $65/head, esp. with directs doing unpaid labor out of "edification".

Or when a diamond bragged about how they drove all night at 110+ MPH in his Caddy to get to Denver from a lodge to get a hunting license for his boy because that's how winners respond to challenges. The crowd whooped and cheered at this "acheivement" Ummm... If you're so friggin' smart Mr. Diamond, you would have had the permit BEFORE you went to Colorado, dipshit. I got put on "notice" for that comment.

The WORST offense was - at the function Dex spoke at - I overheard a distributor say they didn't care for Dex's view on gays and that wasn't the reason they came to hear him speak. A Direct overheard this and got in the person's face and started screaming at them that if they had a problem with what Dex said they would take it up that person's Direct and would have their business revoked.(I'm not making this up - it really happened) Whoa. IBO's are always calling people who criticize the biz Socialists but if you want to see Joe Stalin Communism at work - join Quixtar. Sound like a great business for you? (I know, your group is different - they all are)

Oh yes, one last thing - GOD LOVES YOU WHETHER YOU ARE IN THE BUSINESS OR NOT - stop using God as a crutch. My Bible doesn't say 6-4-2 is the way, the truth, the light. Jesus is. Any schmoe can pull out scripture passages to "back up" their business.

I know I've gone on way too long - and I know the hardcore IBO's will say I wasn't dedicated/lazy/loser or whatever excuse to hide their own shortcomings. That's OK. I can handle the truth - and Amway ain't it.

Bruce S.

Facts:

Communikate is 31.95 month. wwdb isp - its always busy...it sucks

standing order tape - every so often they add $3 on per tape so that they can give that money to a charity of their choice.. they never show anyone the books... go figure, they tell you who to give your money to...in fact every so often the donation goes to wwdbs spiritual leader Billy Tsika Ministries... Its funny we get voice messages saying that Billy Tsika is golfing here and there.. hmmm where is that money going... very fishy

Dear Sir,

You are a rain cloud pouring on a golden opportunity. You lack drive and incentive. Your one track mind got you to where you are today. Do you feel compensated for your lack of ambition by creating such a nonsensical web site such as the one you have. You probably do. For that I pity you. As a matter of fact you should pity your self. You have posted statistics which reflect nothing but negativity on one of the worlds most profitable business opportunities. You have painted a perfect picture of who you are. A quitter. A broke quitter at that. I on the other hand am not a quitter. My checking account reflects that. Our business has helped many people become financially free. What have you done.

One of my firm beliefs on life is you should make an impact. I've done that. Have you. I can answer that for you....Yes. And a negative one, which is worse than not making an impact at all.

If your truly against a business model such as Quitter, its time to take of the economical blind folds. Re think your meek, feeble analyses and write me back, I'm always looking to expand with the right people. Are you Ready.

Coy I.

Hello!

Just found your interesting site while Amway web-hunting. We left Amway during the period it switched to Quixtar and I wanted to see how strong the old horse still is.

My husband and I recently had a rare discussion about our Amway Days. Although I am grateful for the many, MANY personal benefits of our 6 year Amway run, it is still a source of embarrassment and anger for my husband. He can't understand how his work did not produce results when he WAS following the system.

I was a dutiful Amway wife, staying home with the kids 5 or 6 nights a week while he was out "showing the plan" (sometimes going with him and hiring sitters- who made more than we did), I gathered business cards and kept the children quiet during his Sunday night calls.

I must say, he sincerely believed in the program and "followed the plan" to the letter. We attended rallies, drove/flew hundreds of miles, bought the books and tapes, etc. One of the most helpful evenings of my life was seeing Florence Littauer speak at an Amway rally. She was hired by them to speak in Memphis and there is not a day that I don't use what this non-Amway speaker taught.

Despite years of maintaining 100+ monthly personal PV, making literally hundreds of contacts, sponsoring dozens of downline, and sticking to the formula, we did not make direct. We quit when our upline abruptly left us hanging to invest time in a "more profitable leg" (which has since fizzled). There was no more upline support - other than access to their meetings. So much for "we'll show the plan for you if you are unable". It was a bitter time. I suggested we go dormant for the required 6 months to change sponsors. This was actually a good breathing period to step back and see how much frustration and anxiety we had been living under. A way to quit slowly without guilt. Needless to say, we did not get back into Amway. The weight of the world was off our shoulders. How NICE to meet someone new and enjoy their company without seeing them as a perspective prospect.

What Amway did for me: (1) Understanding of personality types and how to deal with them; (2) The ability to look someone in the eye and speak with confidence - even if I was still trying to believe it myself; (3) The understanding that there are few irreversible decisions. We left Amway knowing we could always go back (we won't), but I now know I can adapt to other business challenges.

True, I don't have continual income these days. Never did, though. I have been an eBay entrepreneur for 2 years now and have made more than in all those Amway years. I make that money in my jammies with digital camera (paid for with our first eBay sale) in hand. A day of garage sailing or thrift store haunting and one night at the auction gives me enough stock to keep me selling on eBay. No fancy clothes, no makeup, no hotel reservations. I've also opened a booth in an antique mall - something I wouldn't have had the nerve to do without the Amway experience, I admit. Nor would I have read all the suggested books without my husband's dedication to following the plan.

So, thank you, Amway. You have allowed me to build an addition to the house, stay at home with the kids, put money in retirement, take the stress off my husband as sole-provider --- all with the learned lessons that have made me a successful junk dealer!

I'm sure you get many of these types of emails a day, so I won't go on. I do want to say, however, that I probably wouldn't have believed the facts on your site when we were active Amway Distributors. I would have shaped your words to fit my own opinion. What is it Glenda says at the end of the "Wizard of Oz"? You know, when she tells Dorothy she's had the ability to go home all along and the Scarecrow asks why Glenda didn't tell Dorothy all this earlier. Glenda says something like, "She had to learn it for herself."

Thanks for your efforts

mk

well i would share how exciting and profitable the business is...but....its seems as if you dont post positive reactions to the business. Why do you waste so much time sharing negative information on quixtar/amways model? it seems as if you have to much time on your hands....or.....you tried the quixtar/amway model and was not successful due to your own insuffientsies. All im saying is why make quixtar/amway look so bad through you site? oh and another thing...people always say all they do is brainwash you...well thats fine with me, if there brainwashing me to become a millionaire. Go make better use of your time instead of portraying our business to look bad

Dexter and Birdie Yager were our directs when we got in 5 in depth. Some 22 years have passed, we are inactive for the last 12. what you write and what we have seen and personally experienced are/is the truth, we reached the profit sharing direct level, but the butt kissin and the backstabbing bs, and the political debauchery and blind following the blind, oh work for us at the functions for free type of mentality is unfortunately showing the worst side of our human weaknesses. We were young and hopeful and swallowed the "whole story " , hook, line and sinker. We've been with the largest pins in the world and for those that have built their businesses, God Bless them, but it truly leaves so much to be desired. I salute you for you hard work and determination to take the stand you have , and know that it is always easier to sleep at night when our hearts and minds are clear. There is so much emotion and feelings and frustrations over so much of our lives, all I can say now, is that my wife and I are still together after all these years and our children love us. Regardless that I was counseled to divorce my wife because she wasn't committed, I was in my heart building the business to give her a better life, and why would I want to get rid of someone who truly did and does "love" me, not like the houdini's in amway who love money and use people, contrary to teaching to love people and use money. thanks for stirring up in me some long dormant feelings and giving me a oppurtunity to post my thoughts . I am "free" in Christ Jesus! because the truth sets us free indeed. you are the man! ps we recently celebrated 27 years of marriage. and I am only 48. Not too bad , eh? Lots of diamonds had there marriages together, but my oh my, the love of money is evil, and greed destroys many.

Brian

Scott,

If you do actually read all the mail you receive, you'll certainly hear this a lot:

Thank You.

Mr. Short has put into words things that I have tried to say many times. I was one of the many who would say, "How did I handle that guy? I just 'Bo Shorted' him!"

I guess I'm still in 'recovery mode' from my experience with the business. I'll never regain the time I lost, nor possibly the friends that are also gone, but I will recapture my integrity.

Thanks again, and keep it up.

Dwight

Scott,

Just wanted to THANK YOU infinitely for your site! I was being solicited by an IBO, and was very skeptical but read a few of the materials he provided me. I had just finished "Rich Dad, Poor Dad" ready to start my crusade to personal financial freedom!! I just happened to search on the web and ran into your site. I appreciate all your sound data and supplemental information. I also enjoyed the link to the Rich Dad Poor Dad, synopsis that invalidates and discredits the author. I cannot begin to tell you how vulnerable and quite stupid I feel for almost being pulled into this trap. But again, my many thanks to you. So, just curious on what compelled you to put up this site and do the research?

Have a great day ---

Keep up the great work.

--- JENNIFER

Hi Scott,

My fiance is in "the business" and has been since last April. During that time I had life changing medial problems. At some times he was not there and he attended the weekly meetings or seminars. I am not involved, in fact, I despise the lies these people tell. How can it be legal for people to manipulate mostly younger individuals into thinking that they will become rich in 2 years or less only spending your spare 6 hours a week in this mess. Of course, you must purchase tapes, literature pack, CD's and spend $250.00 (100 points) a month on the internet products. I have tried to explain this time and time again to him but it does not phase him. He insists that this will work and he is the only one who can make it work. We have had countless arguments over this "business." Recently, I came home and all of his things were gone and I was left with a dear John letter. He stated that he loved me but we needed to spend time apart and that will make our relationship stronger. I love this man and I did not give up. We have since reconciled but still need to clear a few things mostly Quixtar issues. The emotional trauma is overwhelming. These people that tell lies should be stopped. There must be something that can be done. It is a cult in my eyes and in my family and friends. One thing is that his whole family is in it and that makes it ten times worse for me to hold on. Make sure that lovers don't give up on one another. I am not about to.

Dear Sir,

My daughter was recently approached with Quixtar. I am very concerned about her for as she has little money and has just begun being an IBO. I have had a gut feeling that something is extremely wrong with the company after I went to a meeting with her. I finally did get out of the upline's mouth that it was Amway. Anything you can provide to me on who and what is going on would be deeply appreciated. So far I have learned some about Amway/Quixtar. But how does ProNet Global fit into the picture?

Sincerely,

Trudy

Dear Scott,

Thank you ever so much for your information. My daughter got out of that crocked business before she lost too much of her money. Again, I Thank You So Much.

Sincerely,

Trudy

Scott, Did you remove Bo's name from the failed marriages list in exchange for his biased report? Shame on you and your ethics! Failed marriage and failed business - why else would he resign. Another failure blaming someone else. Do you provide info on why people shouldn't get married? It would be great....people could post info on why no one should ever date their former spouse. All the really negative things on peoples' relationships would be great....even maybe a new reality series on TV for you Scott. All your worshipers would certainly watch....by the way, you have worshipers, my God, Scott you have become a CULT! Febuary 17, 2003 21:12:51 (GMT Time)

Editors's Note: I sent Bo Short this posting. He was not sure where the site visitor got his information. Bo and Sandy Short are still married after 20 years and have a wonderful 5 year old son. Furthermore Bo has not asked me to remove the sound clips of him from the Amway days that I have on my site. The site visitor is encouraged to send me an email to scott.larsen@juno.com explaining his claim.

Ah, the hype, mentorship and opportunities. You know, when you look at all the inferences to the Bible and living a Christiian life through your Q business and listening to Britt preach and you garner respect for your upline and edify them even if they are fools who lie and deceive - all you have to look at is who involved is a 33rd degree mason and what regime do they support with their soft money. The only answer is to run as fast as you can and as far as you can go to get away from this CULT! Look up the definition of cult, you are a fool to screw other innocent people. Febuary 17, 2003 05:16:05 (GMT Time)

I would say that as an analysist, you've been doing a pretty good job. However, when you provide information on a business, you should consider the satisfaction of the employees, not just according to their short-term income. I haven't been making a lot of money in this business, but my peers have. I would also admit that I didn't give it 100% effort either. No pains, no gains. So there are more than 60% people who quit every year, so what? In graduate schools, people who don't give their best shot are told to leave. Would you say that we close our graduate schools all over the country? Febuary 17, 2003 01:33:42 (GMT Time)

You don't even have the guts to post your name, face and contact information. Man! Your life must be really fucked up! I bet your living in an appartment and barely paying your bills.... enjoy your average life douchbag! Febuary 16, 2003 04:50:33 (GMT Time)

Editors note: My email address is in no less than 38 pages on the site.

I just have to say one thing, this website is a great resource to confuse someone who is not mature enough to make their own decisions about where they want to go in life....enough to help them decide to quit. I have been involved in the biz for close to a year and believe me, its such a relief when someone tells me that he is not joining because of this site. It saves me a lot of time that I would otherwise have spent helping them. The only people who succeed in this biz. in my experience are those who take their eyes off of what they are making and start helping the people they sponsor profitable. When downline is profitable, thats magic, I can promise you that!! Febuary 15, 2003 14:06:06 (GMT Time)

This site is unbelievable!! I mean it - it can not be believed. No doubt people get involved in things and they quit and they blame others (see our country's 50% divorce rate!). There is no guarantee with Quixtar just like there is not with anything. For our family it has done wonders, not only financially but much deeper - I have seen family members and others achieve personal development I never thought possible. For us it has been great. I feel sorry for all of you that thought you were in a lottery - and did not win. Febuary 15, 2003 03:49:05 (GMT Time)

Thank God I found this site before I waisted my time. It was a great presentation on 'passive income', but your research shows the truth. If I want to make $4/hour for some extra income, I'll go work at 7-11. Febuary 12, 2003 18:48:06 (GMT Time)

I have a question for all the Quixbots reading this: How many 6-4-2 IBO plans were shown the past 2 months? I ask this because my IAchieve for Jan./Feb. 2003 does not show any new Diamonds and I know the Quixbots show YOU breaking 6 25% groups and YOU going Diamond. Where are all the new Diamonds? I might add this--where are all the old Diamonds? I wish all the Quixbots would GO DIAMOND already and stop boasting that they're going Diamond...someday...soon. Great site, Scott! Febuary 10, 2003 23:45:36 (GMT Time)

I can see why you couldn't succeed, you spent all your time doing crap like this Febuary 10, 2003 08:18:13 (GMT Time)

My personal experiance has found that you have deleted parts of my experience in your comment section. You mention Comments not related to your personal experience will be deleted. So why did this happen? Is this a place to submit my whole experience or just what you want others to see? very Bias! Febuary 9, 2003 15:12:03 (GMT Time)

Hello all. People are you all insane? Of course the prices are not the best, but we are in it to make money not save money. Do you see any Ferrari's or Mercedes in the Walmart parking lots? Being a coupon clipper is not the answer, if it was we would all be rich. Febuary 4, 2003 22:50:49 (GMT Time)

I have no idea who wrote this, but it should be removed from the internet. You deserve to be broke, this is the best business opportunity in the world. Just because you tried Quixtar and failed, it was your fault that it didnt work for you. A lot of people have tried this and failed....but lets see, not all business's succeed do they? you can answer for yourself. ex. K-Mart is failing. Febuary 4, 2003 22:43:27 (GMT Time)

You need to add a link to your HOT news items: www.mlmsurvivor.com Ruth has updated the amended complaints by Hart, Stewart, and Schmidt The real eye-opener is the part where they say a Pronet Diamond's income is 85% system. Great site. Febuary 4, 2003 21:45:07 (GMT Time)

Seems to be a pretty well designed site - it must have taken tons of research. Pity you didn't put the energy into business, you might have made some money. Personally I think you need to compare the expenses in a quixtar business with a conventional business - catch a wake up folks, stop thinking like a bunch of employees. This is a business opportunity, use it or wimp out, just don't take a whole bunch of people with you 'cos you don't have the guts to become successful. Ryan Febuary 4, 2003 16:34:03 (GMT Time)

HI, Question why would TIF hire Don Brindley as CEO, He ran or still runs Pronet Global and Gemstone productions? Also what is going on over there is is falling apart? Febuary 3, 2003 21:19:07 (GMT Time)

Hey Scott-

Your website is great. I was approached by a joker from a "company" called e-vantex.com, which is associated with BWW. They are the same as Quixtar. The guy followed the "sell" exactly as you described - 2-5 year plan, early retirement, gaining time and money, etc. I was amazed at how similar the mentality was to a cult. I have done some research on cults because a friend of mine was sucked briefly into Landmark Forum before we pulled him out, and it is really not that different than Quixtar. They both offer immediate results in success with minimal effort, preying on vulnerable people. I am also amazed that not only are these organizations allowed to exist, but at the size of these groups.

Keep up the good work-

-Dan

Scott,

I just read through your website about Quixtar. I was suckered into attending an informational meeting last night. -Seemed like a good business opportunity. I decided to hit the net to check out some opposing views. I came across your site and was blown away by the in depth level of analysis.

I felt the need to send a word of thanks. Take care!

-Eric

Having read your article regarding the Ponzi scheme and Don Storms I believe that you should at least be fair in reporting that Quixtar had nothing to do with this.

I sincerely hope you are not trying to make some kind of association by guilt because these people were in Quixtar and then were involved in a Ponzi Scheme. This would not only be unfair, as the two have nothing to do with each other, but would show a desperate bias to try to make a connection that doesn't exist.

I am sure that I am wrong in viewing your reporting this way and will eventually find some corrections on your site regarding the fact that Quixtar has nothing to do with the scheme. It would be like blaming the workers of Enron for the scandle that the executives created just because both of them are in Enron.

Hi Scott:

Thanks for your reply. I appreciate your insight and I agree that people should not be worshiped in any business. This always leads to trouble for the worshiper and the worshipee(s). I also agree that it would seem that someone like Mr. Storms would have known better, but everytime I watch TV I think that about alot of the people who find themselves in a similar or worse position and wonder why they could not foresee their fate.

I guess if everyone realized that there is no such thing as easy money there would not be any news on TV :-).

But as we all know, news should be fair and balanced to be successful, ala Fox News beating most other cable news shows. Your interest in fairly presenting this suggests good motives for reporting the information.

Thanks

You need to get your information correct before you start posting it on your "site".

"please right"?????

One problem that I have noticed about your site is that you need spell check, an English teacher, or a third grader to correct the grammatical errors. I counted 17 errors in the letter from "someone" "quoting" his upline platinum.

On the whole, your site is disgusting and inaccurrate.

K

Scott:

I appreciate your site, and we are currently IBO's in Quixtar. My husband and I are at crossroads of continuing our business in Quixtar. We too have spent alot of money, however, I blame most of our spending on our "insecurities" and getting caught up in the "whoopla". Our upline emeralds are Giovi and Dawn Pici and I noticed he wasn't on your Q12 list for 2001...could you have made a mistake in not listing them or -(Charleston, SC diamond)- as qualifying (we are in Bubba Pratt/Tim Foley LOS. I appreciate any information you can give me, because this information is important in our decision to continue. When will you have Q12 qualifiers for 2002? Is there anyway you can assist us in getting in touch with Bo Short?

Thanx again for your dedication of this site and for allowing anyone to share their viewpoints.

Sincerely,

Gloria

Hi Scott

I just read about the EDC who pulled the real estate scam....is the millions these crooks make from tapes and functions not enough for them. How greedy are these people that they now are onto bigger deals if you will.

How is it that this is not even mentioned in the media. At the least, I would think the Charlotte news would pick up the story on Storms.

Keep up the great work.

Hi Scott !

Funny page. But moore funny is fact that someone spent time and many to do that kind of work. I mean to collect info about all things you wrote.I do not known who are you, but I think you have very comunistic mentality....This site presents common sense business analysis and realistic views of the Amway/Quixtar business model...-ha, ha, ha, ....realistic views.....I suppose, that you were in Amway and something happen and you quit, and this page is yours new genius phylosophy why bussines Amway is bad. So you find people have the some kind of experience.

My name is Waldemar Uberna, and I live in Poland, thats country where comunism political system was from 1945 to 1989 year.

We have in this time no possibilitis to do own bussines, all for us made goverment.Our life was miserable. We ware not free, and we living with feeling like we are in jail.Even our passports were in police and when we wanna go outside country we need special permission.

I,m now not MLM user, but I was 5 years in Amway in Poland and I recive pearl level with incom per month ca 10 times bigger than avverage incom in Poland that time.Now five years I;m not active and even that fact every month I recive moore than is everage income in Poland. Now after five years with conventional bussines ( two small bakery) I wanna come back to Amway because I see that it is the best bussines but not for exciusers and quiters I was erlier..When I read your information about pyramid schems I feel very bad. Maybe you wanna live in comunism country maybe for you freedom to do what you want to do is not important better is investigation people and do big lie to make own good feeling. , The mentality from this and very others pages anti MLM looking very comunistic.What is your mentality, what you are dooing for living.Where you see not pyramid scheme?

Propobly this is your hobby to make others slave. I do not known.Maybe it is yours walk of live and you from this make money. I known only that you make very big lie.Why? I do not known.

World slowly go to katastrofe thru the comuinistic thinking and yours page are part of them

Your work make world more coministic, you distroy free enterprise.

But anyway I wish you good health and peace of mind in new year.

Hi Scott,

Thanks for rewriting,

I;m 14 years in bussines of my own. I known how big price is to pay to succsed.

Do you known how to use information collected from flustrated, socialthinking people? How many % from that info is true. Only from my knowdlenge I find few unactuall info in your page. What is better for people. Say them ,,go on,, or say ,, quitt and live in slevery,,?

and some bad things that some Amway peopla are dooing. It was no secrets.And that info not destroy bussines.In every walk of life ar good people and bad people.Yes or not? Who tell you that in Amway is only happines?There are a lots of struggle.But anyway,thru my five years in Amway I find my best friends and to this days we are with big friendship toogether.

Is yours translator Peter K. from Warsaw?

If yes then I known kind of yours motivation to do that work, we were with Peter few years toogether in Amway.And we waiting for bigger sucsess blaming everybody arround us.

That all for this time

He openly bragged about the $$$ being made. I was skeptical from the start... a bunch of diamonds know more about offshore financing than all the brain power on Wall Street...that is the kind of shit this idiot was telling the downline and they sit there like morons believing it. Post 9-11, he further bragged that the investment did not lose value like all of the stock market.

Makes you wonder...when pins are talking about money from other ventures, exactly how much is their in the actual plan?

Best thing that could happen is for Storms to be charged by the FBI and this thing to make it into the papers. This will finally expose the so called leaders to be the crooks that they are.

Dear Sir,

My sons marine recruiter gave my name and number to a man that wants to talk to me about making money at home with a company called "private franchising on the web".I am trying to figure out if this company and companies like amway are the same.have you ever heard of this company? I have not talked to him yet, and wont if it is a scam,I dont have any other info except its name. Any help will be very welcomed.

thank-you,

mary

Scott:

I am highly suspicious and very skeptical of Amway/Quixstar. I have no intention of getting involved with this or any other MLM. A good friend of mine however is very much involved and tried to get another friend and me to be IBOs. We declined, but asked lots of questions and did not get clear answers. Since then I have been reading lots about Quixstar including your entire site. In fact every day or so I review the "experiences" section of your site. Two days ago a pro-amway person wrote you and alleged you were editing the experiences section of your site. He accused you of being like his old newspaper editors. I didn't think anything of his pro-amway comments because I've seen pro-amway commentors before on your site. But his entire comment did not last 24 hours on your site and it appears that you have in fact edited out his comments. My question to you is; are you infact editing or deleting certain posting from the experience/comments section of your site and if so, why?

John

Scott:

Thanks for the explanation. You site seems very insightful and helpful. We have asked my friend lots of questions about his "internet" business with "Biznet.com", the Harteis Group. He has certain patented answers at first, but when we ask more in depth questions, he fumbles for answers or simply says he'll have to ask his upline. He's a good guy and has been quite shy most of his life. Admittedly the business is bringing him out of his shell, but that's the only good I see in it. I don't want to offend him by confronting him too strongly with points I've seen on your site and others.

I do however point things out from time to time. My concern as a friend is that he's spending so much time on Quixstar he is missing out in his dad's business, which is a real business with proven results. Sure it's hard work, but his father has done fine with it and needs my friend and his brother who works with him to take over the reigns soon. By the way, my friend and his brother just wen to Baltimore for a big Quixstar blow out. I'm sure they paid well for travel, hotel, tools etc. This whole thing started when his brother was approached in a shopping mall by a guy who said he had an internet business. In addition to just watching out for my friend I've kind of made it a case study of mine. I'm probably wasting too much time investigating the matter, but since other people have pitched amway to me over the years, I was curious. One observation that I have is the Quixstar people like to report that their site was so inundated with hits when it went on line that the system went down. They make it sound like everyone in the world was jumping on their site. It seems to me that all Quixstar did was convert over its amway folks to Quixstar in the months leading up to the site opening so that when it opened all the folks signing on were simply the existing amway folks. Thus, the majority of the folks hitting that site were not new consumers.

HI

I enjoyed your sight. I found the ziggy cartoon amusing, Do you have a copy of the B.C. comic strip that featured Amway?

Michael

The tool distribution should be compensated by the upline people handling it. It is work. All businesses need tools. Don't forget that with Quixtar you do not have to "garage" products like other MLM businesses. So the investment is actually quite small.

Thanks for listening. I dare you to add this to your collection on your website. By the way, who pays for that? The whinners? If ever you need something more constructive to do I know of a business that you can make money with hard work and I would be happy to set up a meeting with you. It is free. And, by the way my business sells a great line of trash bags if ever you would like to fold up the garbage in your website.

Sincerely,

Jackie

Thank you for showing me the light. You really do not know what a difference you and your sight made for me. I have a friend who is trying to get me in it, and this may be the end of our relationship "his decision not mine". His loss. Again, thank you so much and keep up the great work.....

Robert

Scott,

Hello! First let me say I have visited your web site found it very informative. Second: would you please keep my name and e-mail address private?

Well I signed up not knowing this business was related in anyway to Amway.

Had I known I never in a million years would have signed up as an IBO. My loss of common sense happened in the spring of 2002. When I signed up as an IBO, I was at a week moment with my income. It was co-worker that approached me, with this new internet business.

My Awakening happened the second week of this year. I decided to do some research and BINGO I found your site and a few others. THANK YOU.....THANK YOU...THANK YOU. You confirmed some things I was already thinking.

I have not sat down and figured out how much I spent on the system let alone how much was spent on over-priced items from Quixtar. I don't think I really want to know the total. I was on TOW, BOM and I purchased a ton of other system stuff for my business.

How do I go about contacting the local media and keep my name out of it?

Thank you for any help you can give me

Hey Scott, Thanks for the information ou send me on the Quixtar/Amway business. I had contacted you after my wife and I attended the St. Louis "gathering". As I stated to you, my "gut feeling" was just so wrong about the whole structure , and I kept picking up on little nuances of doubt and disgust from other folks in the business. I'm so glad that I found your website before I got too involved. I continue to search for a business that I can truely feel good about, and can earn a good living with. I'm curious to know if you know of any such business. Obviously, you had the same desire when you got involved in Amway/Quixtar, so I'm sure if you've come across any other promising businesses, I feel rest assured that you have scrutinized it thoroughly. I don't mean to pry into your business, so to speak, but I'm just looking and thought you would be a good person to ask. Thanks for your time, and take care. David

a very sad site...what is quixtar? is their any good in it...it all sound so depressing, are their any sites about jobs, where their is no need to work 40-60 hours a week 45 years and retire broke no divorces no con merchants, no university fees etc. etc.. is Quixstar in the uk still sounds better than my job.

cheers

Delboy

Dear Scott,

Pete

Dear Scott- I listened to a tape today by a diamond named Steve Stanley from INA organization. He called people who tell others "Oh that won't work for you" "You won't succeed in that thing" etc., to terrorists!! I played the tape twice because I couldn't believe my ears!! He actually thinks that people who would tell someone else that they wouldn't succeed in Quixtar are the same as the terrorists of the 9/11 attacks!! Unbelievable!! Talk to you later!

By the way, I love the updated information on your site!!

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